Gwyl Blaser Posted March 21, 2015 Report Share Posted March 21, 2015 I have a ship that I finished a little while ago that has been bumped hard enough that one of the masts needs to be repaired. The mast in question has broken at a spot where it was drilled for rigging. I hope you can see it in these photos. I am thinking of removing the ship from the bottle, repairing or replacing the mast and necessary rigging and then to rebottle in a new bottle. I am looking for ideas or thoughts from others who might have made a similar repair. Gwyl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSiemens Posted March 22, 2015 Report Share Posted March 22, 2015 I haven't but I think the true master of ship on bottle repair has to be Michel Bardet. Here's his website. http://michel.bardet.pagesperso-orange.fr/indexa.htm Great building tips there as well. He's repaired sibs that are very old and in some cases with broken bottles and broken ships. His work is incredible. JerseyCity Frankie 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Bellinger Posted March 22, 2015 Report Share Posted March 22, 2015 Is that the bark W. H. Dimond? Nice job. The repair probably can't be done inside the bottle. Getting it out can be costly in damage to other masts and spars. Don't forget the straight forward alternative, with a hammer and bath towel. It's a point of preserving the parts of most value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwyl Blaser Posted March 22, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 22, 2015 I haven't but I think the true master of ship on bottle repair has to be Michel Bardet. Here's his website. http://michel.bardet.pagesperso-orange.fr/indexa.htm Great building tips there as well. He's repaired sibs that are very old and in some cases with broken bottles and broken ships. His work is incredible. Thanks for the link DSiemens. I had visited his site a while ago and had forgotten about it. Thanks Gwyl Is that the bark W. H. Dimond? Nice job. The repair probably can't be done inside the bottle. Getting it out can be costly in damage to other masts and spars. Don't forget the straight forward alternative, with a hammer and bath towel. It's a point of preserving the parts of most value. Alex, I think this is what it is coming to. I am thinking real hard about the bath towel and a hammer. Now to decide how to strike the bottle so I don't inflict more damage than it already has. I will take photos of the un-bottling as maybe it might help others to know what to do, or if I make it worse, what not to do, in a similar situation. Gwyl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSiemens Posted March 23, 2015 Report Share Posted March 23, 2015 I hate to see a good bottle busted. Isn't there a way to dissolve or cut the adhesive holding the ship down then cut the forward stay lines and pull her out? If not ya gotta do what ya gotta do. Laying the masts down before breaking the bottle may not be bad idea either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Bellinger Posted March 23, 2015 Report Share Posted March 23, 2015 DSiemens Thank you for the link to Michel Bardet's site. Never seen it before and am very impressed. A good variety of very attractive models. I particularly liked that he includes the hours each model takes. I have done some ship in bottle restorations but nothing of this caliber. Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwyl Blaser Posted March 23, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 23, 2015 DSiemens, I have tried to work around the ship to see if I could loosen it but to no avail. I am prepared to break the bottle. I will most likely wrap it in a towel and then hold the neck upright and tap the very bottom of the bottle to see if I can break the bottom off without a lot of glass falling onto the model itself. Hopefully this evening I will make some progress on her. Gwyl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Fox III Posted March 24, 2015 Report Share Posted March 24, 2015 Greetings Gwyl, Can't really tell for sure where the mast is broken, looks to me like the main mast broke just above where the peak spar attaches. I have fixed broken bow sprtis and masts inside the bottles, or bulbs, more times than I care to think about. if at all possible I do repair them in the bottle/bulb, there is no way any of my models could be removed from a bottle/bulb once finished inside. So, if at all possible, and this usually means I try to fix it before giving up and breaking the container, I "fish" the broken mast parts. If it is a complete break, it is much more difficult as one has to keep the parts in place while working, if only broken part way through it's much easier. Basically, I take very thin pieces of bamboo and tie them around the lower mast part, it takes a lot of wiggling and piggling to do this I know from experience, but it is possible sometimes. If the mast is not broken completely apart, I then force the upper part into proper position and continue tying the thread around it and the bamboo splints. If one uses light brown thread, and can wrap the thread around the broken spar parts tightly, then one can put a dab, or two, of cyano glue on the threads. If you have to maneuver a completely broken through mast into position it is far more difficult, but I have done it at least once. Obviously, bow sprits are easier to to this sort of thing on, but masts can work. I only tried this inside a bottle/bulb because I've had to do it at least several times before on models before they were ever inserted into a bottle/bulb. Doesn't happen often, but occasionally mishandling the model during construction causes a broken mast, and fishing with very thin bamboo splints and tightly wrapped thread will make the mast as solid as it originally was. There is of course the downside of having a bulge added to the mast, but with luck rigging and sails will hide that for the mast part. Anchor's A Weigh! John Fox III Ladysmith, WI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwyl Blaser Posted March 24, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2015 John, Thanks for the tutorial on fixing spars and masts. I was about to get to breaking glass last night but I was to tired to think about cleaning up small pieces of broken glass, so I put it off until today. Im glad I did. After reading your tutorial I want to give that a try. It certainly won't hurt to try, and it won't be any worse off than if I had broken the glass. Gwyl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Fox III Posted March 24, 2015 Report Share Posted March 24, 2015 Greetings Gwyl, That is the way I saw it too, no reason not to at least attempt to fix it, and as a last resort break the glass. I can tell you it's not easy, possibly one could put a tiny dab of glue on the splints to hold them in place on the lower mast while tightly wrapping the thread? I have done it, so I know it's possible, and you've nothing to lose by trying. Good luck! Anchor's A Weigh! John Fox III Ladysmith, WI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwyl Blaser Posted March 26, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 John, You are right. It is not easy. Trying to wrap the mast with splints and thread is a exercise in tenacity! It seems like I am spending a lot of time trying to figure out what I need to figure out. (if that makes sense)? I want to report that progress is being made though. Gwyl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Fox III Posted April 3, 2015 Report Share Posted April 3, 2015 Greetings Gwyl, Great! Glad some progress is being made! I really believe you don't know what can be done, until you've exhausted every attempt and idea to do it! <G> Once you've proven to yourself it can be done, you won't fear something similar happening again sometime. Not that you'd WANT to do it again mind you! <G> Anchor's A Weigh! John Fox III Ladysmith, WI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwyl Blaser Posted April 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 3, 2015 Thanks John, Good words of advice on moving forward, and trying something that once was thought to be to difficult, or impossible. I agree somethings you don't want to do again, but once you have done them, they are not as dreaded as before. Gwyl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Fox III Posted April 4, 2015 Report Share Posted April 4, 2015 Greetings Gwyl, You would NOT believe how much time I've wasted on projects simply because I will get an idea it is possible to make something smaller/better. Guess I am really stubborn or something, I refuse to give up on something like that until I've exhausted every single thing I can think of to make the part involved. One thing that complicates the process for me too is that I always am looking at repeadability in anything I make, it has to be possible to replicate a result fairly closely, BESIDES being able to make something at all! <G> Anchor's A Weigh! John Fox III Ladysmith, WI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Fellingham Posted April 5, 2015 Report Share Posted April 5, 2015 (edited) Greetings Gwyl, You would NOT believe how much time I've wasted on projects simply because I will get an idea it is possible to make something smaller/better. Guess I am really stubborn or something, I refuse to give up on something like that until I've exhausted every single thing I can think of to make the part involved. One thing that complicates the process for me too is that I always am looking at repeadability in anything I make, it has to be possible to replicate a result fairly closely, BESIDES being able to make something at all! <G> Anchor's A Weigh! John Fox III Ladysmith, WI That sounds very familiar except that time isn't wasted when one learns something in the process, even if its only to not try that again. When I talk about that character trait in myself I'm strong-willed or tenacious, when that trait is a part of someone I'm talking with he's stubborn, when a third person with the trait is the subject of discussion he's pig-headed. It's a matter of viewpoint. I just can't stand having a piece of wood (or whatever) kick my ash. Dave Edited April 5, 2015 by Dave Fellingham Chasseur 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Fox III Posted April 5, 2015 Report Share Posted April 5, 2015 Greetings Dave, Exactly! I call it wasted time, mostly as I keep accurate track of every hour spent and what was done, so I can price my models by time taken basically. However, as you say it's not waste time, or as Edison put it, "I did not fail to make a light bulb, I just learned 1000 ways that didn't work". This was prior to his actually finding his working method. Anchor's A Weigh! John Fox III Ladysmith, WI Chasseur 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tubjugger Posted April 18, 2015 Report Share Posted April 18, 2015 Gwyl, you might be able to push the mast straight by wedging a splint of wood between the mast above the break and the side of the bottle, bit of double-back tape on the splint might give it some traction on the glass.Then brush some epoxy around the mast to cover the break and serve as a sort of tubular plastic splint. TJ Gwyl Blaser 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwyl Blaser Posted April 19, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 19, 2015 Thanks TJ. That is an excellent Idea. Gwyl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Bellinger Posted August 10, 2015 Report Share Posted August 10, 2015 I was given this damaged model by Rob Napier and I think it is so well made it should be repaired and given a new home. The workmanship looks familiar so I am putting out these pictures with the hope they might reach the original builder. I won't be able to get to her until early next year anyway. She is an English 4 mast ship about 4" high and 8 3/4" long. Chasseur and IgorSky 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwyl Blaser Posted August 11, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 11, 2015 Alex, She looks like she was a beautiful ship. I know you will be able to restore her to her former beauty. Definitely keep us posted once you start the repairs. Chasseur and IgorSky 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bottleneck Treasures Posted August 12, 2015 Report Share Posted August 12, 2015 On Christmas Eve back in 1981 I was finishing up a ship in bottle I was giving as a gift for Christmas. While removing one of my tools from the bottle I accidentally snagged the rigging and severed the top of the Mainmast. I was crushed and at that point I thought my gift was ruined. I worked into the night and patiently made the repair and was able to give my gift on Christmas Day. To this day nobody can tell what transpired. I would suggest before taking the task at hand and removing the vessel, try making the repair within the confines of the bottle. You may need to cut several rigging lines and add new ones later on. Having had to deal with this many years ago it has helped me learn how to rig a ship INSIDE the bottle. In fact most of my projects require I do it that way as I very rarely use the hinge method on my ships. After building the ship outside the bottle, I dismantle it and rebuild it piece by piece inside the bottle. Gwyl Blaser 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exwafoo Posted August 13, 2015 Report Share Posted August 13, 2015 Hi All, Interesting comments on repairs. I have never tried to do a repair, however there is a technique described in Ship Models in Glass ( see other threads on books) for rplacing a section of rigging in the bottle. I won’t scan the figures or text because of copyright, but will pass it on in my own words and Powerpoint sketch. The tool is made from a rod and two pins. Knot 1 is described as a Sling Knot Knot 2 is half a reef or half a Granny knot depending on how you would tie the second half Method: · Place the loops of knot 1 over the hooks. · Keeping a bit of tension on the threads, use the forward hook to place the loop over the 1st yard. · Whilst tightening the loop, remove the forward hook. · Keeping tension on the thread, move the second hook so that the loop on that can be transferred to the yard. · Remove the 2nd hook. · Place a drop of glue on the knot, spreading the threads so 1 can be cut off when dry. · Let dry. · Place knot 2 over the hooks. · Place knot 2 over the 2nd yard and tighten. Glue and cut as required Full credit to Peter Hille and Barry Young (book authors, lots of other good stuff in the book), and I re-emphasise that I have never tried this method. It would be nice to know if it works. Gwyl Blaser 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy_man Posted June 14, 2021 Report Share Posted June 14, 2021 Hi there, can anyone help?I have a glass ship in a bottle that was originally my grandfathers and sat on the tele for many years when I was small. my young kids have taken a bit too much of an interest and unfortunately it’s broken. Please can you point me in the direction of someone that would be able to do a repair? I’m happy to post anywhere in the UK. Thanks, Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSiemens Posted June 15, 2021 Report Share Posted June 15, 2021 We have a few members in the UK. I wonder if some one can help. If you don't see a reply here try the Ship in Bottle group on Facebook. They are pretty active. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy_man Posted June 15, 2021 Report Share Posted June 15, 2021 Thank you DSiemens, I’ll take a look at Facebook too. I am happy to post outside the UK too, most important thing is getting it fixed! thanks, Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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